Regarding the article that has sent gun owners across the land into blind panic, a few matters need to be clarified.
Firstly, the man was arrested on charges that had nothing to do with his firearm licence, but for pointing/firing his weapon at a third party.
As the case against him progressed, the aggrieved party refused to continue pressing charges. The prosecutor then made the decision independently to charge him for the expired licence, to which he plead guilty and paid the fine.
This info comes directly from the National Prosecuting Authority.
There was a decision by the DPP to pursue the case against the individual purely because of his expired licence. There are other details in the mix that complicate the issue considerably more. (Edited for new information as of this PM – Ed)
Secondly, precedents are not set in the lower courts, so there is no hazard of it being the case here. However, there are concerns regarding this matter being an example of what may happen to people with expired licences.
GOSA has serious reservations about the potential consequences, and has elected to use their attorneys to engage with the SAPS and the NPA to get some sort of moratorium on any prosecution of expired licences, bar further legal action open to them.
See the GOSA attorneys’ letter to the SAPS and NPA here.
As a final point of advice, do not use cheap legal counsel to represent you in issues of such a serious nature if you can afford better. The result of such an imprudent decision can cost you in the long run.
Paul Oxley
•6 years ago
Please see GOSA’s response to this specifically and to renewals in general at https://www.facebook.com/groups/2471105086/
gunservant85
•6 years ago
Link updated.
Brittius
•6 years ago
Reblogged this on Brittius.
Ben Venter
•6 years ago
Kan u my asseblief help met inligting?
Ek het ‘n .38 rewolwer en my lisensie is nog in die ou donkerblou id boekie.
Ek het nog nooit aansoek gedoen vir ‘n ander lisensie nie.
Ek verstaan dat my lisensie nog geldig is, kan u dit bevestig?
Baie dankie
Ben Venter 0828025031
gunservant85
•6 years ago
Môre Ben. Jou lisensie is inderdaad geldig, asook enige lisensie wat uitgereik is onder die our Arms and Ammo Act. Jy kan gerus wees.
tinusd
•6 years ago
I think we should highlight that there was an agreement between the State and the dealers’ association that the police would not act against expired licence holders until the court case on the matter has been finalized. Now we are saying that the prosecutor and the SAPS are not on the same side? That’s nonsense, pure and simple.
In my view, it is a clear indication that a matter that was not deemed to be “urgent” last year, has suddenly become very much so.
This is the view of the DFO in Bedfordview, Johannesburg: http://bedfordviewedenvalenews.co.za/306850/firearm-licences-must-be-renewed-in-time-2/
It speaks volumes.
gunservant85
•6 years ago
I agree wholeheartedly. An agenda is being driven. We have also received new information this afternoon that backs this up. And we are acting on it.
gunservant85
•6 years ago
I am entertaining this misinformed (misguided?) comment purely for educational purposes.
Firstly, the website provided is for public NGOs: none of the firearm rights organisations (or even GFSA!) are listed on it as an NGO. So perhaps work on your Google-fu a little next time.
Secondly, Clark Attorneys is legitimate and has been successfully litigating on behalf of GOSA members for considerable time.
Lastly, 22 000 people did not “like” a page on Facebook: they joined a community and sees themselves as members thereof. I have 5500-odd subscribers, but according to your logic because they don’t pay me money they are not really subscribers or readers. They must be imaginary people then.
Just because something doesn’t fit your narrow binary view does not mean it is incorrect. Not even remotely.
John Moses
•6 years ago
Your “layer” quoted “Non Profit Organization” in the letter…
And Gun Free South Africa ARE listed on that link…
Gun Free South Africa info@gfsa.org.za, 111 Muller Street, Bellevue, Bellevue Central, Gauteng P O Box 3048, Killarney, Killarney, Gauteng 014-085 NPO 25/09/2001 Registered
A legitimate lawyer, maybe(just because you said so), but I’d expect a bit more professionalism if it were my money… I see similar comments on the GOSA facebook page about the language usage as well. Or is my view narrow and binary again?
3. Portraying facebook page “likes” as a membership to an NGO or NPO (which one is it? – link the registration somewhere please) to the general public is deceitful. Spin away. I may subscribe to your Blog, but you have no right to use me as “leverage” or portray me as anything other than what I am…a reader of a blog, or facebook page.
gunservant85
•6 years ago
Here is the kicker: if you subscribe to a group or service, you are a member of that group or service and can be counted as such. Don’t want to be counted? Don’t subscribe or join. So your argument falls spectacularly flat right there.
And obviously GOSA is an NGO as well as an NPO: all NGOs are NPOs. This is public knowledge.
Your commentary regarding the professionalism of the legal team is quite irrelevant.
Do you actually have any value to add to this discussion, or are you just a troll?
Ludwig Churr
•6 years ago
Thanks for the facts that should not stand in the way of a good story. Agree that precedents are not set in a lower court. However other cases will refer to this judgement. That will stand until it is either set aside or overturned. Like a small steam that joins other small streams to make a mighty river. Many small lower courts making the same judgement cannot be a good thing. So if 20 small courts base their decisions on this one ruling, then there will be 21 judgements and 21 rulings all saying the same thing. Then the task of overturning becomes more erroneous and costly. A stitch in time has relevance here.
Ludwig Churr
•6 years ago
Hi Moses, (not the red sea one)
So my comment that GFSA only has 450 twitter followers as per their annual financial statement touched a nerve then?
Ouch?
DdBPhoto
•6 years ago
John, what’s the point of your petty nitpicking?
Are you happy they started arresting people with expired licences even though there was a deal in place not to do so?
Or are you unhappy that anyone other than SAGA is speaking for gun owners in South Africa?
gunservant85
•6 years ago
Ask GOSA these questions and you will get your answers.
The letter is “posturing and a joke” in your not-so-humble-opinion, which says it all really.
End of discussion.
Ludwig Churr
•6 years ago
Hi John, I see 3 John Moses on FB. One is Calabar Nigeria which I do not think is you.
That leaves 2. Are you the blank face one with 6 friends?
Asking for a friend.
gunservant85
•6 years ago
Dear Samuel: if you have queries, direct them to the organisation in question. This comments section is not for cheap sniping from the sidelines. No value added: no further discussion.
Ludwig Churr
•6 years ago
Thanks Moses.
I have not had sight of the posturing lawyers letter. Do you have a copy for me so that I may comment?
Peter
•6 years ago
Is this not an excellent opportunity to gather support for a proactive organisation that actually want to lead this fight and make significant advance? Getting firearm owners behind an organisation that was willing to go to bat and lead proactive firearm owners in obtaining their rights to self-defence and safety. Helping firearm owners follow leaders with some back bone and willingness to challenge laws and police action that is nothing short of oppression and deliberate endangerment of public safety.
Is that not a great deal better than the pretend organisations posturing with strongly worded letters, lawyers and court action or pretending they can actually negotiate something with nobody willing to back them up? What do these pretend negotiators and leaders do when the answer is no? Beg? It is not possible to negotiate from a position of abject weakness and when your demands are not met you have no choice but to bring out the troops.
Here is a news flash nobody fights what they accept. If the organisation has preached acceptance of iniquity it has shot itself in the femoral artery and will bleed to death. One fights bad laws not accept them, one fight for the safety and security we all deserve. One fights for what is right and important to life. One does not risk your like for ownership of a gun.
Where is this organisation and who are the leaders who have had 16 years to figure this out and have not even gotten close. When will their minds open and they see their way to accepting the responsibility of the promise they give to members?